Twin Mills

Wes

Well done Bill. Youve gone and made Brett cry.

Hope my modelling skills get to that point someday.

Bill

Well, Wes, he didn't say if they were tears of joy. Maybe it was a cry of "Oh my God, NOOOOOOO!"

You might be on to something..."Kits to Cry For"

admin

joy.....

Bill

I just finished up the cut lumber for the drying shed. Nothing difficult about it, but you need to plan ahead so that you have enough wood. You should be able to get 8 boards out of each 12" strip of 2x10. You may want to make the boards a little smaller than the recommended 1 1/2". I found that it took 15 pieces of stripwood to make the taller stacks (about 1 1/4" tall). That'll give you 20 rows of 6 boards (requiring 40 2x2 spacers). I varied the height of all 5 stacks leaving the smaller ones to look as if they were still being completed. Using Aileen's Tacky Glue worked better than regular Elmer's. With plain white glue, the boards slid all over the place as I tried to build the stacks.







I also wanted to get a little color variety in the stacks of lumber like you see in this picture. It's all fresh cut wood, but there's a big range of colors:



To do that, I just colored a few ends and edges of the boards with some Gold Ochre 231.3 chalk. I think it helps break up the uniform look of the raw stripwood. Just a few here and there in no particular order or pattern.





All the stacks and loose boards are glued down, so I'll be heading up to the roof next.

PaulSmulders

Bill, the Twin Mills build is fantastic and your attention to details is fantastic.....inspiring.

Paul

LSNRwyAl

If I had three thumbs I would give you that... only have two so "two thumbs up" !!!
Wonderful and the extra effort your put in makes this look outstanding.

Karl.A

Fantastic touch varying the board end colours!! It really elevates the scene, small things like this separate the few from the many.
Very nice work again Bill, even on something as simple as a stack of wood you are showing that taking it an extra step makes all the difference.

Karl.A

Wes

Just brilliant Bill. I love the variation you have achieved just like the real thing.

admin

Attention to fine detail... I think this might be your specialty Bill. The subtle color variation of the wood stacks is a fine detail that would never "stand out" in a huge diorama like the Twin Mills However... it is the cumulative affect of these fine details that makes for one awesome model!

Bill

Wow...thanks for all the comments, guys! I agree, Brett. Unless somebody told you, you'd never notice it. But "new lumber" always puzzled me when I'd see it modeled in the magazines. Something wasn't right about the way it looked, and I think this helps a lot. It'll show a little better when I get the stacks placed out on the platform.

Bill

I need to borrow your eyes again. The first roof is done (the one over the drying shed). It's a tarpaper roof probably kept functional, but not in great shape since it's part of the old mill. I had no luck finding prototype pictures of this type of roof. Too many colors? Too many loose ends? Or leave it as is?

Wes

Bill I found this picture for you.



Your colours seem bang on. My only concern is that tar paper roofing is fairly heavy stuff, and in my opinion wouldnt stand up so much. However Im no expert and im sure someone will find a picture of it.

Kevin

Hey Bill
I agree with Wes as the coloring is great, just glue down the overly raised areas and it's perfect.
As Brett says your attention to detail that probably will not be seen is what makes a good dio a superior one. This is why to me the so called "1 foot rule" is an unacceptable way to model. Your point about how a lot of guys model fresh cut stacks of lumber is so right on. Although a lot of modelers don't use Floquil anymore a good way to slightly color new lumber was to use the dirty Diosol that we all cleaned our brushes in. Anyway, fantastic work Bill!

Kevin

LSNRwyAl

So I went into the internet and found these pics. Maybe we overdue the "worn look".
Just a thought.

Bill

Wes & Kevin--you guys were right on. Just for fun, I measured with an HO figure and one piece was sticking up almost knee high! Yep--not realistic!
Kevin-thanks for the idea about the diry Diosol. I'm also doing to try getting all the of the Rembrandt Gold Ocher shades and make a few light washes with a few of them. If I divide my pile up into thirds or fourths and use a different wash on each, I should get rid of that "model" look on the fresh cut wood.
Alan-thanks for those pictures. That top one reminded me that I wanted to try Brian Nolan's toilet paper method! Maybe I can do that on the roof over the donkey engine and the tool shed.

Here's the "non-knee high" tarpaper roof:

Bill

One other thing that caught my eye was the transition from the wood walls to the tar paper. It seemed too clean, especially since the roof is almost flat. So, using a light dusting of raw umber, I pulled the chalk up with a make up brush. Now it looks like it's got some rain back splash. Again...very subtle, but I think it makes a difference.

Wes

That looks so much better Bill.

I keep going back and looking at that first picture of the 2 and I cant believe how realistic that scene looks.

Bill

I got a lot done on the board and batton roof of the Old Mill. The fire barrel walkway isn't completed yet, so I've got the roof in place just for a test fit and photo opp. The first thing I noticed was my relatively crummy drybrushing job on the right roof panel (pics 4 & 5 with the larger opening). The colors look a little streaky, too. But, those are minor problems that are easily fixed. Overall, I'm pleased with how it turned out.












One other issue I noticed: What am I doing wrong on this corner with the corrugated panels and how can I fix it?



Here's a quick shot off of the model for color reference:

Kevin

Hey Bill
Going back a few pics you did a great job with the chalk simulating the splash between the wall and tarpaper roof. I love to see the chalks used in this subtly done way.
On the big roof is the larger patch corrugated panels? If so then these panels would not conform to the roof boards as you have them now. If this is tarpaper or a piece of tarp then it would conform to the boards underneath (at least to some extent). Also if the battens are still there what would be getting patched? Hope this is not too nit-picky because everything really looks fantastic.

KO

Bill

Not nit-picky at all, Kevin. That's what I asked for!

The larger patch (all black) is tarpaper only. That's why it conforms so snugly to the battens. What's getting patched? Heck if I know...I don't understand how a roof like this didn't leak everywhere even when new! As modeled, there's boards that look rotten here and there and, in one spot several were completely replaced. In others, they slapped on some tar paper.
The manual suggests using wider boards and tar paper patches for added character. But, the pics are b&w so it was tough to tell exactly where the tar paper was located. As I searched for other pictures, I found a board & batten roof Brian Nolan did with patches:



My thought was, the roof leaked at the bottom; they patched it up with a metal panel and tried to seal the top edge with some tar paper. As I think more about it, one structural problem is these battens:



They don't make sense. How would they have gotten the panels underneath of them? So I could eliminate all or pieces of those two, but still...the color bothers me. Doesn't look right.
I could tarpaper over the entire thing, but that's taking the easy way out!

Kevin

The one thing about how tarpaper and even cloth tarps are modeled is that we all make them "over conform" to what they are covering up. Even Bri did it on his roof. On your roof I would just not press it down quite as much if you know what I mean. How about making a patch with corrugated that is not so rusted and disintegrated. Maybe do some tar seams around a couple of pieces of corrugated and maybe a scrap of old batten nailed crosswise on top.

Kevin

Bill

I went back and reworked this little problem area. By accident, I discovered that I'd been etching the corrugated material incorrectly. The past few times I've worked with this stuff, I'd let it bubble up in the acid, rinse it in fresh water and then dust on some powders. This time I etched and rinsed some panels, but then let them dry on my glass surface overnight. That made a huge difference. As the water evaporates it leaves behind a natural rust and corrosion. Here are some of them...no paint, chalk or extra materail added:



Hopefully the effect shows in the picture. Some got really rusty, others were a weathered black, and others had some nice blueish gray tones. I found that it wasn't even necessary to let them dry overnight. An hour or two seemed to be plenty.
As for the patch...the more subtle weathering effect looks pretty good. I still need to add some chalks to the tarpaper piece and drag the powders down onto the wood. Not perfect...but a bit more believable:

davej

Hi Bill
your build is fantastic and I can't wait to get started on mine.
With the etched roofing you may want to consider sealing it with dullcote or something similar. I found that if you allow it to air dry it actually continues to rust slowly and eventually gets a very dusty coating before crumbling away. This does take 12 months or so but it is a bit of a pain to go back and redo it. Even worse when you do a whole roof of it.
cheers
Dave

MikeM

How have you been cleaning off the etchant afterward?

As an aside, how have folks been disposing of used etchant? I'm reluctant to just dump it down a drain...

Here's an interesting link to the site of a guy who's come up with an etchant you can concoct from stuff you may have at home.

http://www.stephenhobley.com/blog/2011/03/02/still-messing-with-forces-i-dont-understand-the-formula/

Bill

Dave-
Thanks for mentioning that. In previous builds when I used the Radio Shack etchant, I just rinsed it with water, dried it and hit it with alcohol and chalks. That's probably why I never saw this rusting effect. It's been only a year on the last project and I haven't noticed the rusting effect continuing, but now you've got me a little concerned! I'll have to keep an eye on it.

Does Dullcote neutralize the echant? Or does it just seal the surface and prevent it from oxidizing?

Mike-
I did a good rinse on the aluminum pieces (rinse twice in 2 separate containers of water). The first rinse is to stop the chemical reaction, the second is to get off any remaining etchant. After the 2 rinses and air drying, that's when I got the corrosion effect. I've read some guys add baking soda to one of the rinses, but they said that tends to leave a white residue and advised against it.

To dispose of it...(and I'm not a chemist) add some baking soda or washing soda to the spent etchant to neutralize. Once neutralized, you can pour it down the drain: http://www.mgchemicals.com/techsupport/ferric_faq.html

davej

the dullcote just seals the surface to prevent further oxidising as far as I can tell. With my previous use of the etchant I didn't use alcohol or chalks as I found the colour to be just what I wanted. The alcohol and chalk may neutralize the etchant to some extent.
still looks good though.

Bill

Cool. Thanks for that info. I'm getting close to roofing the larger section which is covered completely with etched panels (560 of them). The last thing I'd want is to have to re-do the thing 12 months from now!

davej

yes that would be horrible
I found that dullcote darkened the colour of the rust a little and gave a very nice rusty colour without the need for chalks etc so it may be worth a bit of experimenting.
I have attached a photo from my railroad camp diorama to give you an idea of etchant plus dullcote with no other treatment.
cheers
Dave

Bill

I think for the first time during this build a made a goof--a big one. One of my measurements was off when I was laying out the structure locations putting the old mill a half inch too close to the new mill. Nothing that can't be fixed, but it was enough to cause some considerable stress. Here's the issue:





By placing the 2 structures a half inch too close, that left the roof card too long by half an inch. The only two possibilities to fix the problem: pull up the new mill and slide it over half an inch (not an option, really) or trim the roof card by that amount. Because of the location of the openings for the roof trusses, the card had to be trimmed off the angled side:



With the roof card cut to the correct length, I set about building the two peaks that extend out to the left and right. This entire portion of the roof needs to be removable in order to have access to the lights that will be going in and to allow the interior to be viewed. I built these peaks on the workbench in the same manner that Mike E. described at the bottom of this page: http://www.railroad-line.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=24460&whichpage=38

I left the boards a little longer at the top where the peak forms and sanded the edges until the fit was correct. After glueing the 4 sections in place (to the roof card only), I completed the cap by filling in with shorter planks all the way to the roof card. Here's how it turned out:







Removable!



Since the roof can come off, I added some additional purlins between the trusses in order to stabilize them and keep them in position:



The sheet metal panels are all cut and ready for weathering--all 558 of them!

Wes

Well done on the roof save Bill. It came out well.

558 roof panels?? rather you than me.